Water cooler

Welcome to the water cooler This is a place to find out what is happening and to discuss our external projects and activities. Feel free to suggest ideas that could help our charitable mission or ask questions about how you can help. To discuss the inner workings of the charity, head over to the engine room.

WMUK Grants programme - a piece of cake?

Applying for a grant is easy.

If Wikimedia UK can help you improve Wikimedia projects, check out our grants page.

2009 2010 2011 2012 2013 2014

10,000 research quality maps of the world

Map of Britain, Samuel Thornton, c.1705
Scan at 6,078 × 4,968 pixels.
NYPL maps project page.

I have been drafting a note about this GWToolset based maps upload project for the Wikimedia Commons Village pump. The upload should complete within the next couple of days (due to extreme file sizes, and an WMF Operations request to throttle speed of uploads, this has taken a lot longer than I expected). As this is Chapter supported media, would a UK blog post along similar lines published at the same time be of interest? --Fæ (talk) 10:20, 8 May 2014 (BST)

Notice posted here. --Fæ (talk) 12:04, 9 May 2014 (BST)

A UK blog post would be very interesting. As I mentioned below, this should really be on the Water Cooler as it relates to an external programme. Would you be good enough to repost there? --MichaelMaggs (talk) 14:52, 11 May 2014 (BST)

Done.

If my blog account ("Fae") is re-enabled (it appears to have been restricted from editing without anyone informing me), then I will draft a post on WordPress. --Fæ (talk) 17:11, 12 May 2014 (BST)

Hi Fae, if you'd like to draft a blog post about this excellent project I would be more than happy to publish it with an appropriate attribution on your behalf. Stevie Benton (WMUK) (talk) 18:17, 12 May 2014 (BST)

I would rather create it exactly as it will be displayed using my account, which is on the system. I was under the impression that volunteers can do that, rather than eating up employee time cut & pasting and reformatting. I assume that there is a review process for draft blog posts, though I recall that the board of trustees no longer needs to approve them. --Fæ (talk) 21:05, 12 May 2014 (BST)

I'm going to skip this now. Too many days have passed since my notice on Commons about the project, and time passed without further response here. My original intention was to hold off the Commons notice for a day or two so that the post on the chapter blog would be news.

It would be nice if we could return to allowing unpaid volunteers to draft blog posts on WordPress, rather than this entirely relying on employees along with the associated lost opportunity costs. However this is just an observation comparing how things used to be done, not that long ago, to the reality of how the charity works today. This is not a request for an employee to do anything, neither is it a criticism of employees, the shift to using closed processes for managing the chapter blog being the choice of the board of trustees. --Fæ (talk) 14:21, 20 May 2014 (BST)

Trained trainers - post-refresher meetup

Alcohol can encourage sharing, but may inhibit other brain functions required for learning.

Not that kind of workshop!

Who is going to the refresher of the train-the-trainers course on Saturday the 28th of June?

Who would be interested in some kind of meet-up afterwards?

We could do something that evening or something on Sunday. We could do an informal chat over a pint or we could have some kind of workshop where we share and reflect on our experience as trained trainers and learn from that. It depends on who is around when and what exactly is planned for the refresher. I don't know what is planned for the refresher yet but perhaps we should start by asking questions of availability.

Who will be around the evening after the refresher? Who will be around - or could arange to be around - the next day?

Yaris678 (talk) 13:33, 14 May 2014 (BST)

Sadly I can't make the training on the Saturday, but a meet up sounds like a cracking idea to me. It was great to get to know everyone better at the Manchester TtT event. Richard Nevell (WMUK) (talk) 11:49, 16 May 2014 (BST)

Registration was opened two months ago, with prospective attendees approached by direct email, and there is no public registration page or schedule (the emailed link was to a restricted web page which specified timing as 9.30am—6.30pm). I would not like to make plans around it until there is a confirmation that there have been sufficient numbers, and confirmation that registrations were accepted. --Fæ (talk) 11:32, 20 May 2014 (BST)

There is no public registration page because this is not a public event, rather one intended only for people who became accredited trainers for Wikimedia UK before February this year. Thryduulf (talk: local | en.wp | en.wikt) 11:41, 20 May 2014 (BST)

I would say it is an event restricted to past trainees, it does not automatically follow that we must not use an open page to coordinate the event, such as discussing the schedule and content, sharing a list of who is coming or negotiating the social side. Coordination by direct private email increases the number of touch-points needed to confirm anything, and makes change unlikely, rather than the wiki norm of self service and encouraging suggestions for changes.

As a counter example, ARC meetings are restricted yet have an openly shared agenda in advance of meetings, public minutes afterwards, and a long term open meeting schedule, all of which can be discussed by anyone. Ensuring processes of the charity default to openly sharing as much as we can, rather than defaulting to closed communications, is part of meeting Value 4 of Vision, values and mission. In this case, one consequence of coordinating using closed channels would be that no other volunteers who might happen to be interested in training, would think of joining an evening social nearby. --Fæ (talk) 12:01, 20 May 2014 (BST)

Registration is not on a pending-approval basis, anyone who registered has a place. If it were on a pending-approval basis, the registration confirmation page and email would have stated so. Yes, the event is happening. The exact programme for the day is determined by the training provider base on expectation provided by attendees during registration. There's nothing stopping discussion and or planning happening in public, such as is going on right here......... Katie Chan (WMUK) (talk) 12:56, 20 May 2014 (BST)

Thanks for confirming that, I was unaware of it and would not want to presume. If the training provider (Midas?) can provide a schedule/description it might be an idea to create a simple event page and move this specific discussion about the day's logistics to that talk page. As there is time before the event, the provider might want attendees to have a pre-discussion on expectations, which is not relevant to share on the watercooler. Is there a reason to not share the attendee list? I doubt this has an expectation of privacy, or represents private data. --Fæ (talk) 13:50, 20 May 2014 (BST)

I have created the page Train the Trainers refresher 2014. Anyone got any thoughts on it before we link to it from Events? Yaris678 (talk) 15:07, 27 May 2014 (BST)

Cool. I note that Katie added the link to the event from the events page. Now we have somewhere to keep discussions about the event. Yaris678 (talk) 16:51, 29 May 2014 (BST)

Tools for identifying Wikimedians at press events, etc

Albin with Wikipedia microphone

Copied from a post I made to the UK mailing list at Michael Maggs's request:

Reading about the making of videos at Eurovison I was stuck by the positive response to the "Wikipedia representative", not least engendered by his use of a branded microphone windshield (see third picture in the above post; that windshield is far too big for use on the Zoom H1 which I use for the voice project, but something smaller would be useful).

Similarly, my local branch of OpenStreetMap issues mappers with branded high-viz vests; these often reassure the public (or at least facilitate the opening of a discussion), when someone is walking down their road noting house numbers and other features.

I suggest some thought is given to providing WMUK volunteers who are likely to attend press calls and related events with something to identify them in a crowd; this could include microphone windshields, tabards, baseball caps, or perhaps something else.

I strongly suggest that the primary brand used should be Wikipedia, with Wikimedia and WMUK (or WikiNews or whatever) beings secondary, as it is the former which the lay public recognise most readily; and which elicits the positive response referred to above.

On a related note, are we ever going to get the promised business cards?

Michael asked:

perhaps you could kick off a discussion there by summarising the sort of recognition and/or materials that you would find it helpful for the charity to supply?

I've mentioned some items above; I welcome suggestions from others. Andy Mabbett (User:Pigsonthewing); Andy's talk; Andy's edits 20:57, 15 May 2014 (BST)

I sent an email yesterday to the UK list and it has not been posted. If any one wishes to read my summary of the background, please email me for a copy. There seems little point in re-sending emails to the list as I have been given no explanation. Be aware that any emails I send may misleadingly appear in the list archives as if it was posted at the time I sent it. Thanks --Fæ (talk) 14:04, 16 May 2014 (BST)

Or maybe the list admins haven't got round to dealing with it yet. Probably best not to speculate on motives. Richard Nevell (WMUK) (talk) 14:30, 16 May 2014 (BST)

(edit conflict) I have removed anything from my comment here that was more than bald facts, to make sure it is now extremely hard to read bad faith into it. The email of concern was posted on 15 May 2014 @14:16. If it does get posted, it will appear as if it were posted before six other emails in that thread that in practice were written afterwards. --Fæ (talk) 15:20, 16 May 2014 (BST)

Thank you. Richard Nevell (WMUK) (talk) 15:23, 16 May 2014 (BST)

Business cards

I would hope that we can make the best possible use of this excellent suggestion to increase the range and scope of our charitable work.

If we were to supply business cards or other items implying accreditation, what should be on them? Something like "Volunteer Photographer, Wikimedia UK" or the equivalent, with the globe logo if we can persuade the WMF to allow us to use their trademark in that way? The wording "Wikipedia representative" may not be possible as we are not legally allowed to speak for the "Wikipedia community" as a whole, in the same way that we cannot control what goes into the encyclopedia. Just thinking aloud here; of course we will have to look into the legal issues of representation before we can be absolutely certain about what is safe. Ideally, it would be best if we can avoid having to print disclaimers, as any sort of legalise will tend to undermine the member and will scare people off.

What would members find useful, in practice?--MichaelMaggs (talk) 23:01, 15 May 2014 (BST)

Why the word "volunteer"? from comments on the mailing list there seems to be an assumption that it offers some form of legal indemnity to WMUK, or WMF; I remain to be convinced that that's the case. I've used my (voluntary) work with the RSPB as a yardstick before; when I appear in public alongside their paid staff, I have the same type of badge, and the same branded clothing, as they do. The voluntary nature of my participation is nowhere made apparent. [I've split this as a subsection of the above, lest that get bogged down]. Andy Mabbett (User:Pigsonthewing); Andy's talk; Andy's edits 00:04, 16 May 2014 (BST)

That was just my suggestion. I suspect that the term, or something equivalent, might be needed on a formal business card, but as you say would seem unnecessary on clothing, badges and so on.--MichaelMaggs (talk) 07:39, 16 May 2014 (BST)

as far as I'm aware Andy is right and defining someone as a volunteer does not limit the charity's liability. My view is that if we want to be a volunteer led organisation we should provide volunteers with cards. The charity would need to consider and take steps to limit any liability which might arise as a result. This would however possibly open up a distinction between 'officially-approved' volunteers and others doing the same kind of work on their own initiative. How would everyone feel about that? Any suggestions for the basis on which cards should/should not be issued? Mccapra (talk) 17:06, 17 May 2014 (BST)

As I understand the logic of the previous debate, it was essentially that if we gave volunteers business cards, they would be representing WMUK. The board, in their infinite wisdom, thought that was an inherently bad thing, but there was also the small risk that somebody "representing" WMUK might say something silly, that somebody might take them seriously, and that WMUK's reputation might suffer as a consequence. That's a lot of ifs buts and maybes if you ask me. Volunteers representing WMUK should be seen as a Good Thing™, and the advantages of business cards to people like Andy and me (who talk to a lot of people and often need to follow up, or give others a way of following up should they wish) far outweigh the hypothetical drawbacks based on an overly conservative approach to risk. On a list of most useful things the chapter could d for its volunteers, business cards would be pretty high up on my list. If it's really necessary, we can sign some sort of agreement. Harry Mitchell (talk) 10:58, 24 May 2014 (BST)

Bear in mind that the composition of the board was almost totally different during that 'previous debate'. I can't speak for past boards, but I can say that the current board is more than open to discussing ideas such as this which could help volunteers be more effective in the work they want to do in association with the charity.--MichaelMaggs (talk) 13:32, 24 May 2014 (BST)

I can speak with personal recall of board discussions (for goodness sake, it was hardly that long ago and plenty of discussion was publicly on this wiki), the issue was volunteers making up fantasy titles rather than being an "inherently bad thing", however the trustees wanted to care not to hurt anyone's feelings. Being open to discussing ideas with volunteers is not an invention of the "new" board of trustees, giving out that perception is unhelpful and truly smacks of damnatio memoriae, in most measurable ways past boards were far more engaged in discussion with volunteers than the current set. --Fæ (talk) 14:16, 24 May 2014 (BST)

Your last sentence is accurate, Fae, certainly. It wasn't the volunteers who made up the vanity titles, though (indeed, I Tip-Ex'd it out on my cards), but the phrase used for getting us replacements was "within a week"... Harry Mitchell (talk) 17:18, 24 May 2014 (BST)

This is now on the agenda for the next Board meetingMccapra (talk) 18:54, 24 May 2014 (BST)

Thanks Harry. I have no idea why anyone promised to get replacements within a week. I doubt it was me, based on my personal experience of it taking almost a year to be supplied with replacement business cards, and by the time I actually had them in my possession I was on my way out the door, so they became an extremely expensive notepad. I never found out how much they cost, but I think it would have been in the region of £140? Enough to provide lunch and travel for a modest edit-a-thon. It's been said before, but I hope the board actually ask about costs this time around, as it seems fair to make these costs a matter of public record. --Fæ (talk) 20:17, 24 May 2014 (BST)

I'm not sure I'd go along with the logic that the business cards would be a replacement for an editahon (nor, even, that the editathon would be the better investment, even if it has more tangible results), but I do take your point on costs. It seems reasonable for people to know how much they cost and weigh that up against the benefits for themselves, I agree. "Within a week" was the phrase used (just one of those things that sticks in the mind, I guess) but I guess recrimination for the events of yesteryear isn't really helpful, and I take Alistair's comment to mean that the board will consider the issue carefully, which is progress at least. Harry Mitchell (talk) 22:37, 24 May 2014 (BST)

Clothing

Anything visible, like t-shirts/hoodies (perhaps with writing on the back, rather than the front?), baseball caps, camera cases/straps, and other props that people would use anyway lends itself to being branded, which makes it visible. I do agree that the Wikipedia logo is the one that people recognise; if I have to spend ten minutes explaining the difference between Wikimedia and Wikipedia, we've defeated the point (which is to be recognisable, and to catch people's eye with something they immediately recognise and have positive thoughts about). Harry Mitchell (talk) 11:34, 24 May 2014 (BST)

Camera straps would be good idea, if the brand is very prominent. Clothing would need a logo (perhaps breast-pocket sized) on the front, if the purpose is to identify the wearer to someone facing them. Andy Mabbett (User:Pigsonthewing); Andy's talk; Andy's edits 19:49, 28 May 2014 (BST)

Scholarships to Wikimania London

Wikimania 2013 group photo

Application for scholarship support to attend this year Wikimania is now open. Wikimania 2014, the 10th annual international conference of the Wikimedia movement, is being held between 6 and 10 August 2014. The venue is in the Barbican Centre, London.

To qualify for assistance, you must either be based in the UK or a UK citizen living abroad, and agree to produce a public report (which may be published on the Wikimedia UK blog and/or in our newsletters) summarising the key things that you have taken from the event. Applications may be made for the cost of conference registration, accommodation for the duration of Wikimania, and/or travel within the UK.

Application should be made by completing this application form. The deadline for application is Sunday 8 June 15 June. After the deadline, we will be in touch to offer scholarships as soon as possible. Any UK residents who have previously made an application for scholarship through the Wikimedia Foundation process and had agreed to share their application details with their local chapter need not apply again. -- Katie Chan (WMUK) (talk) 17:19, 16 May 2014 (BST)

Thanks Katie. May I ask out of curiosity how many scholarships are on offer and/or how much money is being made available for this? CT Cooper · talk 19:10, 18 May 2014 (BST)

It will be depending on needs and applications. The estimated amount is approximately £7,800, which is on par with last year. I hope that helps. Regards -- Katie Chan (WMUK) (talk) 14:22, 19 May 2014 (BST)

Bad copyright rules killed Hadfield's Space Oddity

There is an interesting op-ed in the Ottawa Citizen[1] complaining about misuse of bad copyright law to take down Chris Hadfield's cover of "Space Oddity" on the ISS. This is something that is probably of interest to many people here - maybe something we can issue a comment about? Also covered by Boing Boing. Thryduulf (talk: local | en.wp | en.wikt) 13:43, 19 May 2014 (BST)

The UK community of active volunteers might not have a solid consensus that this was "bad copyright law". It is no surprise that David Bowie would want to protect the copyright of his most well known works, or have the performing rights negotiated, before finding them globally published. If there is interest in taking official positions on copyright, there are other examples that would illustrate how UK copyright law or its frequent poor interpretation damages open knowledge; misunderstood orphan works or national institutions claiming commercial rights on publicly funded copies of public domain artwork spring to mind.

Thanks for highlighting the story, there are interesting user comments on the article. --Fæ (talk) 12:20, 20 May 2014 (BST)

Wiki Loves Monuments UK 2014 planning meeting

Wiki Loves Monuments United Kingdom

Wiki Loves Monuments is a public photo competition around cultural heritage monuments, organised by volunteers within individual countries taking part. Last year UK competition focusing on Listed Buildings resulted in over 11,000 photos being contributed by over 500 participants. An in-person planning meeting has been scheduled for this year UK participation of the competition. This is to take place on Sunday 29 June from 12:30pm BST at the Wikimedia UK office building in London. Wikimedia UK will cover travel cost of attendees going to the meeting. For more information, and to sign up to attend, see WLM 2014 planning meeting. -- Katie Chan (WMUK) (talk) 13:55, 29 May 2014 (BST)

Connecting knowledge to power: the future of digital democracy in the UK

Hello everyone, Wikimedia UK and Demos are encouraging Wikimedians to participate in an attempt to crowdsource a submission to a call for evidence on digital democracy from the Speaker of the House of Commons. You can find the consultation page here and we look forward to hearing from you. Full information about this call can be found on the consultation page on Meta here. It has also been shared via various Wikimedia mailing lists and I do hope you'll take part in what we hope will be interesting and useful. Thank you. Stevie Benton (WMUK) (talk) 15:16, 29 May 2014 (BST)

Supporting new editors and measuring retention.

Aaaron Halfaker from the Foundation says he is happy to share this posting from wikiemdia-l which I think might be of interest:

I'm a research scientist working for the WMF. My research focuses on the nature of newcomer participation, editor motivation and value production in Wikipedia. See [1] and [2] (if you have the time) for my most seminal work on the subject.

As you'll see in the study I referenced, my work directly addresses a substantial portion of the questions you've raised. See also my team's work with standardizing metrics[3] including survival measures[4] and my work exploring retention trends in ptwiki[5]. See [6] for an example of a recent, cross-language study of newcomer article creation patterns. Also, you might be interested in [7] since it confirms your general concerns about the speed of speedy deletions.

A lot of the work of /really understanding Wikipedia/ is only half-way done since it takes a long time build understanding about previously undocumented phenomena. The academic community, other researchers at the WMF and myself are in the middle of developing a whole field around how open collaboration systems like Wikipedia work, common problems they have and how they can be best supported.

While we're developing this general knowledge about engagement, production and retention in our communities, we (the research & data team) are also working directly with product teams at the WMF to measure their impact on key metrics (e.g. participation) with scientific rigor and to challenge/develop/refine theory on which product strategies lead us toward our goals and which ones do not. See [8] and [9] for examples of such studies.

I welcome anyone who'd like to continue the conversation about what we do and don't know about Wikipedia(s) to raise discussions at wiki-research-l[10]. There are a lot more researchers on that list than wikimedia-l. FWIW, I tend to follow that list more closely.

1. Summary: http://www-users.cs.umn.edu/~halfak/publications/The_Rise_and_Decline/

2. Full paper: http://www-users.cs.umn.edu/~halfak/publications/The_Rise_and_Decline/halfaker13rise-preprint.pdf

3. https://www.mediawiki.org/wiki/Analytics/Editor_Engagement_Vital_Signs

4. https://meta.wikimedia.org/wiki/Research:Surviving_new_editor

5. https://meta.wikimedia.org/wiki/Research:Ideas/Is_ptwiki_declining_like_enwiki%3F

6. https://meta.wikimedia.org/wiki/Research:Wikipedia_article_creation

7. https://meta.wikimedia.org/wiki/Research:The_Speed_of_Speedy_Deletions

8. https://meta.wikimedia.org/wiki/Research:Onboarding_new_Wikipedians/Rollout

9. https://meta.wikimedia.org/wiki/Research:VisualEditor%27s_effect_on_newly_registered_editors/Results

10. https://lists.wikimedia.org/mailman/listinfo/wiki-research-l

-Aaron

Jon Davies (WMUK) (talk) 15:52, 30 May 2014 (BST)

Rather than reposting emails on-wiki, the convention is to link to the original, like this. One benefit is that interested volunteers can read the whole thread and take part on Wikimedia-l if they wish, rather than duplicating/dispersing discussion on the Chapter water cooler.

If things are less stressful in the office now, could someone please remember to give an answer my outstanding question about expected WMUK plans? It has been waiting for 3 weeks for a link or anything more than a place-holder comment, and it was intended as a very simple question that would require hardly any employee time, or indeed none. Thanks --Fæ (talk) 16:18, 30 May 2014 (BST)

Wikimania 2014: Informal visit to Barbican Centre

Wikimedians visiting the Conservatory at the Barbican Centre, 8 June 2014

In order to start getting a feel for Wikimania 2014, we shall be having an informal visit to the Barbican Centre on Sunday 8th June. If you fancy coming along, please add your name here. We will be joining the London Meetup later. 18:46, 30 May 2014 (BST)

Thanks to everyone who came along. I hope it gave you a better insight of what to expect for Wikimania 2014. Some photos have already been uploaded to commons, which includes some pictures from the Free Culture Weekend.Fabian Tompsett (WMUK) (talk) 10:39, 11 June 2014 (BST)

Trainers needed for workshop in London

RGS Headquarters

WMUK is supporting a Wiki Workshop for Geographers at the Royal Geographical Society (1 Kensington Gore, London SW7 2AR) on Monday 7th July 2014, 1pm-5pm. 2-3 trainers are needed for this event, one of whom will need to act as lead trainer. Travel expenses will be covered as usual. Please direct questions to me or sign up on this page, if you're willing to join in as a trainer. Thanks! --Toni Sant (WMUK) (talk) 17:31, 3 June 2014 (BST)

Bed/couch needed for Wikimedian this weekend in London

Hi All

A Wikimedian is coming from the Netherlands (Ter-burg) to one of the Wikimania fringe events this weekend and would like to know if anyone has a bed/couch available he could stay this Saturday in London.

Thanks

John Cummings (WMUK) (talk) 11:55, 5 June 2014 (BST)

Can you help categorize 6,000 photographs (photochrome) taken in the 19th-century?

Can you name this Beefeater?
TIFF format, 2,736 × 3,680 pixels, 28.83 MB

I am just over half-way through uploading the Library of Congress' collection of photochrome prints and hope to complete the collection in about a week's time. These were taken between 1890 to 1900 and were created using an unusual process of putting a high quality black and white photograph as a base for colour lithograph printing. Colours were added by hand and several layers were used (more than six). The high quality cards were incredibly popular at the time as gifts to send by post, and are mostly of famous locations around the world, or of people in their national dress. Images are being uploaded in both tif and jpg versions, and I am sorting them by country.

These are high quality scans, the tifs being over 3,000 pixels on the longest side, and represent some of the best and most popular photographs of the 1890s. Please enjoy browsing the files, and consider helping with a bit of categorization or reuse to illustrate Wikipedia articles of these notable locations.

• UK collection: Category:19th century photochrome prints of the UK and Ireland
• Main category: Category:Photochrom prints collection

--Fæ (talk) 09:57, 7 June 2014 (BST)

Sir Francis Drake's House near Severn Bridge, Gatcombe, Glos - our most recent image of a grade II* listed building

Hi Fae, great photos, apart from the amount of ivy it is surprising how little the buildings have changed in the last hundred years. Though [Category:Camberley_Wellingtonia_Avenue trees] and landforms can be very different. I made a temporary category at Commons:Category:19th_century_photochrome_prints_of_the_UK_and_Ireland_(uncategorised) - there are still a few in there which have yet to be moved from there to better categories. Could you possibly add any that are currently only in the two categories 19th century photochrome prints of the UK and Ireland and Photochrom prints collection to that working category? If anyone else wants to join in, some of the ones that remain are ones I am struggling to locate. 176.221.192.97 10:54, 16 June 2014 (BST)

Will try adding to my LoC housekeeping script. Note that the uploads are still happening so more may appear. The total number of files should hit nearly 12,000, so more than 80% seems done. I have just started "upgrading" all jpegs to very high resolution, matching the tif sizes; this will probably take quite a while to complete (weeks probably) as it relies pumping everything through my (not great) home broadband connection. Hopefully the charity will pay the previously offered contribution to my broadband costs, even if the Chief Exec and the board of trustees leave me unable to pay to renew my membership and so have no status to make any more proposals to benefit the mission. --Fæ (talk) 12:27, 16 June 2014 (BST)

Umbrellas

On Saturday night I was on a party on Swansea beach. As the weather was showery there were a couple of people with umbrellas, one of which was a Wikipedia umbrella and this attracted the attention of a few people. One asking "Where does one get a Wikipedia umbrella?" the answer was Germany, as this umbrella was courtesy of WMDE, but it got me wondering why Wikimedia UK doesn't have umbrellas? Given the stereotype of both the British people and British weather, they seem like an obvious cultural fit to me. Thryduulf (talk: local | en.wp | en.wikt) 16:39, 10 June 2014 (BST)

Cost I think. Umbrellas are pretty expensive (and they have to be done well because we don't want tatty merchandise that falls apart). Worth looking into though. Richard Symonds (WMUK) (talk) 19:11, 10 June 2014 (BST)

3D printing?

Has anyone explored the possibilities of bringing 3D printing to Wikimedia? With prices of printers themselves tumbling, and the application of the technology expanding everyday perhaps it's something to explore. I've used it personally for making all kinds of tat, trophies, keyrings, little 3D trinkets, perhaps the kind of stuff that Wikimedia could use as promotional items?

The tech lends itself very well to the whole open source movement with models being easily wrapped up and uploaded to websites with accompanying CC licensing. Perhaps commons could be made to incorporate this kind of media with a view to making development and production of 3D models more accessible?

P.S this post came about from attending my first wikimeet event, which I'm posting from right now. Nonlineartom (talk) 15:01, 14 June 2014 (BST)

It has been discussed before. I propose that we organize borrowing one or hiring it to be on display and in use during Wikimania. I suspect that a manufacturer would probably loan one for the event for free. If we can set up an instruction page, Wikimedians might even try designing a few things to print out on it during the event (limited edition 3D Jimbo action figures would be worth a fortune on eBay ;-) ).

As there seem sufficient interest on email lists[2][3] in this as a project, could someone please raise a draft proposal at Project grants? Not currently being able to pay £5 to renew my membership, means I am not allowed to make this proposal myself. There is not much time before Wikimania, but there should be enough to either purchase a kit for the hackerthon, or arrange a loan of a demo printer. --Fæ (talk) 08:13, 15 June 2014 (BST)

All sounds interesting, personally I've used a reprap before and they can be absolutely infuriating at times to make them reliable with decent results that don't resemble a toddlers attempt to ice a cake (in 3D) The tech seems to have moved along a lot in the past 2 or 3 years and having been a regular attendee of a fab lab in the north I've had the luxury of using, and breaking most makes and types of 3D printers. The latest generation of Makerbots really bowled me over with their reliability and ease of use, on the old "Denford Up!" printers I was getting maybe a 30% success rates on prints, all sorts of problems with prints coming loose from the print beds, or going horribly wrong 4 hours into a 6 hour print job. I'm still in contact with a guy called James Kitson who used to manage the Fab Lab at Keighley and now works for Denford in a job to do with their 3D printers I think. I still don't think they make the best products but he might be someone to speak to about borrowing a printer for wikimania?

Also worth noting I *think* the makerbot is closed source with it's print software but the printer itself runs off an arduino board so loading g-code from an open source print application should be doable. Am I able to make this proposal as a total n00b? Nonlineartom (talk) 18:03, 15 June 2014 (BST)

Being new is not a barrier to making suggestions. Especially when you bring some new knowledge to the table. I may be on thin ice here, but I don't see how the printer being closed source is any worse than a PC being closed source, and lots of people read and even edit Wikimedia projects using closed source PCs. I'm assuming that the open side of this is in the designs themselves. As for relevance to our project, tat is one thing, it would be nice to be able to give attendees 3d printed flip flops, mousemats or umbrellas but that is a bit peripheral. More important is demonstrating usefulness in education. John Cummings has shown me software that creates a 3d model from multiple 2d images, I think it would be great if the Wikipedia article on the Broken Hill Skull not only included text, images and maybe a 3d image you could rotate, but also an openly licensed 3d model that you could download and print. Jonathan Cardy (WMUK) (talk) 18:49, 15 June 2014 (BST)

I think what you are referring to there is the 123D suite of tools from Autodesk, which are amazing. Specifically 123D catch which as you say, creates 3D models from a series of 2D images with astonishing accuracy. It's totally free for non commercial use and it's all server side, the software just uploads the images to autodesks servers where it does all the computation and spits out an .obj 3D model complete with full texture map. .obj's are an open format so you can use free software like meshlab or netfab to view and manipulate the mesh, clean it up and prepare it for printing, and here lies the tricky part, actually getting something prepared for printing.

I agree with your comment about it not being a deal breaker using closed source software and hardware in a workflow, but the more open the better simply because it gives us as a community greater opportunities to learn, develop and fundamentally improve the underlying technology.

It's also relatively simple to go from fully open source modelling software like Blender to 3D printers if you want to create from scratch. My personal favourite use of printers has been playing around in Google Sketchup which has a very fast learning curve, not for engineers used to engineering terms but for novices who just want to draw things, in 3D. Within minutes you can have an accurate model of a building, which you can submit to google for inclusion in google earth, but also print a scale model quite easily. I don't know much about Wiki loves monuments but could there be a potential tie in here? Just thinking out loud. Nonlineartom (talk) 19:09, 15 June 2014 (BST)

User:Nonlineartom I feel your pain about RepRaps, I've had a similar experience, one thing that I feel is missing from this discussion is that prints take hours and hours so not really suitable for things to give away. However it could be used to show the potential for schools to print their own educational models etc. Are there any particular models that would be of interest? Thingiverse.com is a useful place to look. I have a fairly reliable 3d printer that I could print a few 3d models from before hand, however I will be working during Wikimania (I'm working at WMUK at the moment organising it) and it's not the sort of thing you can just leave going on a stall. --Mrjohncummings (talk) 11:48, 17 June 2014 (BST)

I've been talking to the guy I know who used to run a fab lab, he's passed me information of someone who works at Denford who might be able to sort out providing gear for wikimania, who do I pass this information onto? He also said the latest gen of reprap's are comparable to Up and Makerbot printers but I'm yet to be convinced. Just looking on eBay there are dozens of makerbot clone kits out there based on arduino that should give decent results. Sadly none in kit form. I think the idea of building a 3D printer during Wikimania is actually really cool, especially with timelapse camera(s)

I know what you mean about prints taking hours, the way I saw it working was to leave the printer in wikimedia office, quietly chugging away day after day making a few dozen bits of merch a time so there is a stock built up for events as well as it working on the day, hopefully working predictably by this point and not spewing plastic spaghetti all over the desk. If a kit was used I'd be happy to use the laser cutter I have access to for manufacturing a new chassis (the cheap bit) appropriately adorned in wikimedia livery. The box like ones are probably a bit easier to transport which would make it great for taking to schools to demo and experiment with. I use thingiverse a lot, it's a great tool but an even more open wikicommons based hub for models would be brilliant in my mind. I'm not very familar with Wikimedias work with the wider community and I should probably read up on what the bigger goals are of the foundation. I just like the idea of more people using 3D printers as an everyday solution for fixing instead of replacing stuff. Nonlineartom (talk) 14:00, 17 June 2014 (BST)

SUGGESTION - some good ideas here (declaration - I do actually know Nonlineartom IRL!) Could John and Tom have a skype/hangout/mumble/meeting on the astral plane and look at ways to maybe use Wikimania to introduce/explore this with a view to longer term outcomes? I love the idea of using it to print buildings from Wiki loves monuments or museum exhibitions and donating or lending them to schools to make collections/heritage more accessible which is very much in line with our mission. Could use Wikimania to gauge interest from the community in delivering such a project if you had a printer running and a sign up sheet? :-) Katherine Bavage (WMUK) (talk) 14:24, 17 June 2014 (BST)